Thu Jul 03 12:22 2008 - Logging Started (suburbansenshi-chat)

[12:22] <IrnChef_Jovian> Guys I'm a little worried about Ami-chan.

[12:24] <IrnChef_Jovian> It's been three days and she's still reading the same two comment threads on Metafilter and Boing Boing.

[12:24] <// J_Daito //> Is this something you'd need to be an A-list Blogger to worry about? Because unless "Boing Boing" refers to the DoA breast physics engine I don't give a s[BLEEP]t

[12:25] <IrnChef_Jovian> I dunno but she's been over at my place for the last three days just hitting refresh on her Mercury Computer

[12:25] <Mizunomics01> Well it's an interesting dilemna.

[12:25] <IrnChef_Jovian> Oh you were here, Ami-chan?? ;

[12:26] <Mizunomics01> Yes.

[12:27] <Mizunomics01> Boing Boing has for years harshly scolded other sites and government agencies for deleting information, yet has resorted to censorship and doublespeak to handle a situation on its own site. Additionally, the site moderators are being quite insultive to the userbase.

[12:27] <SpeedRcrX> Like how

[12:28] <Mizunomics01> Saying that people who have delurked to comment once are doing it not out of concern for the community but just to fuel trolls.

[12:29] <FireFly_9> So the question is "do creators (and commenters) have the right to unpublish their earlier works/statements."

[12:29] <FireFly_9> Sorry, "delete." Boingboign was using the euphemism "unpublish" for that.

[12:29] <SpeedRcrX> See here's the thing

[12:29] <SpeedRcrX> This is what I do.

[12:30] <SpeedRcrX> If somebody is trolling or being an asswipe I nuke their s[BLEEP]t but I leave a marker like [ASSTASTIC BULLS[BLEEP]T DELETED].

[12:30] <Mizunomics01> Boingboing just made silent edits. No one knew anything had changed.

[12:31] <Mizunomics01> They did this to expunge some of their own most inflammatory statements as well. (Likening the material they"unpublished" to "piles of s[BLEEP]t on the floor."

[12:31] <SpeedRcrX> See, again. If I think what someone said is a pile of s[BLEEP]t I will say that and stick to it.

[12:32] <IrnChef_Jovian> Why does this matter, you guys?

[12:32] <Mizunomics01> To *us* it's not really relevant in a "how will this affect my life" stance.

[12:33] <Mizunomics01> It's a personal dispute on a high-profile blog that betrays a sense of hypocrisy amonst the management at odds with their stated philosophical positions.

[12:34] <Mizunomics01> But as a case study on how to badly mismanage public relations, and why being open and honest with your editorial policy is necessary, it is simply invaluable--I recommend anyone who has to deal with the public read these two monster threads to learn what to do, and what not to do.

[12:37] <IrnChef_Jovian> We don't have a written policy, do we?

[12:37] <SpeedRcrX> Not really needed

[12:37] <FireFly_9> "Policy" is a mistake. It's about people first. Policy just provides guidelines for people to work with.

[12:38] <SpeedRcrX> My rule is simple: This is my house and if you stir s[BLEEP]t I will mock you, kick your ass and kick you out. If you don't like it, tough. Don't stir s[BLEEP]t then.

[12:39] <SpeedRcrX> That way everyone knows what to expect. Be nice and you get treated nice. F[BLEEP]k with me at your peril.

[12:39] <SpeedRcrX> "Haruka's Golden rule"

[12:39] <SpeedRcrX> Damn I like that

[12:39] <SpeedRcrX> *goes to write that down*

[12:40] <FireFly_9> You could put it more politely

[12:40] <SpeedRcrX> Nah, best to get to the damn point.

[12:41] <Mizunomics01> What bugs me is that it's been three days and Cory Doctorow (arguably the voice of the site when it comes to issues like censorship) is still silent on the issue.

[12:42] <IrnChef_Jovian> Okay my question: A few weeks back we had a troll here, and all thier comments were removed with stuff like [TROLL DELETED FOR GREAT JUSTICE] How is this different?

[12:43] <Mizunomics01> Because Boing Boing silently erased the comments, there was never even any indication they had ever existed. They also deleted comments that had been replied to, so there were quotations downstream that were orphaned in a sense.

[12:44] <SpeedRcrX> See if you have a troll and you delete their s[BLEEP]t but make it known you did so, people can ask you about the whys and what not. You're not obliged to keep the bulls[BLEEP]ttery in the public eye, but at the same time you're still owning up that something had happened.

[12:45] <Mizunomics01> It's about trust. The main thrust of the issue at BoingBoing is this: "Well, someone has been quitely altering the archives, the FAQ, and even some of you comments published in this thread. And apparently, it has been going on for at least a year."

[12:46] <Mizunomics01> Since it was silent, revisionist history, it becomes impossible to judge the merits of a situation later on down the road. Marked redactions would have been more forthright.

[12:49] <IrnChef_Jovian> Meh, thank goodness I run a restaurant and don't have ta worry about this stuff.

[12:50] <SpeedRcrX> Well what if there was a food poisoning outbreak you'd need to deal with it.

[12:50] <IrnChef_Jovian> I guess

[12:56] <Mizunomics01> What bugs me about the boingBoing situation in particular is something one of their people said: "Part of the issue here, as we're realizing, involves the power of a link -- which, if a blog has large enough footprint, can involve money."

[12:57] <Mizunomics01> Boingboing is the third most popular site on the internet. They removed links to Violet Blue because they did not want to endorse her over a personal dispute.

[12:57] <SpeedRcrX> So what

[12:57] <SpeedRcrX> there are places I won't link to as well

[12:58] <Mizunomics01> But that phrase makes it sound like it was an attempt to damage their target financially.

[12:59] <SpeedRcrX> See what they should have done then is edited out the links and said "We don't support this site, sorry" instead of blackholing them without any mention.

[12:59] <SpeedRcrX> It iz all abotu ze balance.

[13:01] <SpeedRcrX> I mean if people look hard enough HERE I still have things from people who later went on to cause s[BLEEP]t.

[13:01] <SpeedRcrX> I don't link to them currently, and would raise hell on anyone who did, but I ain't going to deny that before all the a[BLEEP]lery they did some good stuff.

[13:05] <FireFly_9> * plucks a comment from the BB thread: *

FireFly_9 pasted:

blogs are a bit like living things, and on occasion one must scratch a few annoyances out; there's no rule that bloggers must suffer fools and fleas.

[13:05] <SpeedRcrX> Yeah but again it's how you do it.

[13:07] <SpeedRcrX> "leave a trail of thoughtful annotations so that no one needs resort to screenshots or independent archives to track how the content has been manipulated."

[13:11] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> * delurks *

[13:11] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> "This is our living, but it is also absolutely personal, this is our home base. "

[13:12] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> I feel kind of the same way about this site, it's not our home page but it's our home base

[13:12] <SpeedRcrX> LOL

[13:13] <SpeedRcrX> Well your proper homepage is still going on about Mi Goreng noodles

[13:13] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> Urusai those are good!!

[13:14] <IrnChef_Jovian> Our home base... I kind of like that idea...

[13:15] <IrnChef_Jovian> The way Crown used to be (before it got turned into a McDonald's...)

[13:15] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> Ne, Ne... so how are things with Motoki-san??

[13:15] <IrnChef_Jovian>

[13:15] <IrnChef_Jovian>

[13:15] <IrnChef_Jovian> He's actually a nice guy... the furry thing creeps me out, but... I kind of like him

[13:16] <Mizunomics01> Mako-chan didn't you say that exact thing about him some weeks ago?

[13:16] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> Hai, hai!! We want details!!

[13:16] <IrnChef_Jovian> H-Hey! there are no details! We just had dinner and went to the park a few times!! ^^;

[13:17] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> Moh, you need to step it up a notch!

[13:17] <SpeedRcrX> "Kick." BAM!

[13:17] <IrnChef_Jovian> ... I think Emeril is overrated

[13:17] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> I could see Mako-chan doing a cooking show...

[13:17] <IrnChef_Jovian> R-really?

[13:17] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> ^^...b

[13:19] <FireFly_9> "It seems like you think of BB as a livejournal with a very exclusive membership."

[13:19] <FireFly_9> What exactly *is* this place

[13:19] <SpeedRcrX> What the f[BLEEP]k we've been around for almost six years now and NOW you're trying to sort this s[BLEEP]t out, 'Taru?

[13:20] <SpeedRcrX> It's just where rei.bot dumps our damn chatlogs

[13:21] <FireFly_9> but most of us now have personal blogs on the side, too

[13:22] <@spiritflame> suburban senshi a collective of awesome since two thousand two

[13:22] <SpeedRcrX> LOL badass

[13:22] <SpeedRcrX> I missed your haiku

[13:22] <@spiritflame>

FireFly_9 pasted:

"Unpublish" is a weasel word you'd do well to abandon. I don't care what the button on your interface is labeled. To the outside world, the content becomes inaccessible. Quibbling over verb choice only makes you seem disingenuous.

[13:26] <SpeedRcrX> Why'd you quote that 'Taru?

[13:27] <FireFly_9> Just wanted to. It's a good point to remember.

[13:29] <SpeedRcrX> The day I use doublespeak like that someone shoot me

[13:40] <SpeedRcrX> ANYWAY ENOUGH ON THIS

[13:40] <SpeedRcrX> I will share something funny from my currently continuing stay as a Canuck

[13:41] <FireFly_9> You aren't Canadian, Haruka-poppa, just visiting

[13:41] <SpeedRcrX> Shuddup

[13:51] <SpeedRcrX> Anyway there's a supermarket chain in Ontario called "Dominion"

[13:51] <SpeedRcrX> Now if anyone has ever watched Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, the main bad guys in that series was "The Dominion"

[13:52] <SpeedRcrX> Thus, every time I see a Dominion store, this image comes to mind

[14:21] <Mizunomics01> * stifles laughter *

[14:21] <IrnChef_Jovian> I don't get it

[14:21] <FireFly_9> Hah!

[14:21] <FireFly_9> Apparently there is more to the sugar than it seems!

[14:21] <IrnChef_Jovian> I don't get it

[14:22] <[gTV]C'est_la_V> Star Trek otaku are weird, Mako-chan

Thu Jul 03 14:22 2008 - Logging Stopped (suburbansenshi-chat)